As “A Boy and His Script” enters week three, we jump right into the second part of the three part Daniel Petrie, Jr. Interview. For a quick recap of the previous post, Dan gave us a brief history on his screenwriting education deep in the mailroom of ICM, an in-depth comparison of Character vs. Plot and a few tips on the absolute necessity of outlining. In part II, he gives us the step-by-step though process that became the Plot for The Big Easy, a few of the biggest mistakes any new writer can make and his thoughts on the various tools involving software, seminars and research outlets all at the screenwriter’s disposal.
So enough of my rambling. Here is Daniel Petrie, Jr. . . . the second part.
—–
ABaHS: Once you had made up your mind on what genre you wanted to work within, what was your process from that initial idea to a workable outline? Creatively speaking, how did you decide?
DAN: One fact was to work in the area of cops and police. I’ve always been interested in that, which right away gives you the realistic promise of life and death stakes. Of course, people see cop movies all the time so much so there’s really no need for another unless you have a different angle. So I thought, “What about a corrupt cop as a hero?” At that time, this was twenty, twenty-five years ago, we really hadn’t seen that. [The corrupt cop] also suggested something about the female lead. Suppose she’s a D.A. or someone who’s investigating police corruption? Those opposites suggest that it’s both a serious investigation and a romance. The structure of a romantic comedy and a romantic drama are identical. It’s just one looks at the emotional conflict and casts a humorous light on it and one’s more heartfelt about the emotion conflict, but the conflicts are basically the same. Guy meets girl, they fall in love, obstacles, whether they be misunderstandings or people intervening to propel them apart and something that brings them back together in the end. I thought that [the romance] would make an interesting counterpoint to a cop thriller. Still, this is a pretty mechanical construction, but sometimes you have to take a leap of faith and see how far you can get with something like this. I thought further that it’s not a very noble thing to be a corrupt cop, but are there circumstances in which that character could still be sympathetic? I thought, if the cop is only as corrupt as the environment in which he finds himself, he’s not doing anything worse, but he’s not doing anything better than the other cops and it would really be highly unusual in that city for a cop to be incorruptible.
“Sometimes you have to take a
leap of faith and see how far
you can get with something like this.”
Then you think, “Okay, that’s got interesting moral ambiguities you can make use of.” Then, when you think about [the female lead], you think she’d be working in the same environment. She doesn’t think any of this is right. She may know the city itself has a level of corruption, but disapproves. That leads you to think her character is upright, but also has a quality of being morally rigid and inflexible, which is
admirable, but comes at a cost. Whereas, he would be very comfortable with inhabiting this gray area of morality that would inform all areas of his life. He would be confident, sensual, very at home in his own skin and she’d be uptight. What if these characteristics are revealed in their sexual lives? I thought this was an interesting relationship between these two. So what started as an absolutely rote paint by numbers exercise became gradually over this process something that I regarded as special. Something that I was tremendously excited by. It had these qualities that I was looking for. It was familiar, but really different. It was originally called “Windy City” and set in Chicago. We eventually decided to set it in New Orleans as The Big Easy. It worked very well. That’s an example of taking what I regard as “half an idea,” teasing it through and ultimately deciding this is good enough.
ABaHS: If you still weren’t satisfied after “teasing it through”, would you go back and try to rework the idea?
DAN: I would tend to put it aside if I had really given it the whole college try of going through what associations I had with it.
ABaHS: When starting a new script, what do you think is the biggest mistake a writer can make?
DAN: One of the great things about my own accidental education of becoming a writer was that in order to get out of the mailroom at ICM you had to be a reader, which got you closer to becoming an agent. So, I’m reading scripts that I simply didn’t have access to. The scripts I did have access to before were only the good scripts. Robert Towne, Paddy Chayefsky. That’s quite daunting and you think, “Jesus, I can’t do that.” When you’re a reader at an agency you’re reading the scripts as they come in. These are people who aren’t represented yet and haven’t managed to get an introduction where an agent is eagerly reading the scripts themselves. That can give a young writer a lot of confidence, because you almost immediately think, “If I can make an effort to spell, I can outclass a great many of these.”
“If I can make an effort to spell,
I can outclass a great many of these.”
Also, one thing that was quickly revealed is that I found people didn’t really either know or have enough of a rigorous sense about what it actually takes to accomplish what you’re trying to accomplish. I would hear confirmations of that from the horse’s mouth, from people seeking representation. I would read a script and think there’s some talent being shown by this writer, but it seems like the story isn’t that well thought out and I’d hear things like, “I figured it was a first draft and if someone’s interested enough they’ll tell me how to rewrite it.” I though, wow, this is an industry that has overfull employment. If you want to break into the business you have to write a great script, it can’t just be a good script and certainly it has to be the best that you can do.
“If you want to break into the business
you have to write a great script,
it can’t just be a good script.”
I would constantly see scripts that would reveal in their first pages a lack of sophistication of the structure of a screenplay. Aristotle famously promulgated the structure of a drama as that which has a beginning, middle and an end and before the beginning there is nothing. Many of the screenplays would begin with nothing. Meaning before the events of the story start taking place. If you read a lot of scripts you may read some that begin with an alarm clock going off and the character wakes up, goes and makes coffee and usually there’s a funny bit about the coffee grounds that reveals character on how messy their kitchen is or whether they’re neatniks or whatever. They get dressed and go to work, but really nothing is going on. They just don’t know where to begin the story. So literally they have the character waking up on the day that something is going to happen. The ACTUAL beginning of the story. That wouldn’t be so bad if that was THE mistake and just fixing that by lopping off those extraneous five pages fixes it, instead they’re usually indicative of a far larger problem involving material that belongs in a first act that isn’t in the first act or adversaries aren’t being introduced until page eighty. The lack of understanding and lack of structure just compounds and compounds itself. I happen to think really understanding screenplay structure is vital. It doesn’t mean you can’t intelligently break the rules or do something radical, but that’s a helluva lot better when done deliberately. Done out of laziness or ignorance isn’t that exciting.
“I happen to think really understanding
screenplay structure is vital.”
ABaHS: Would you attribute a lot of that laziness or ignorance to the explosion of software, seminars and generally everybody promising to teach you how to write a great script, but not focusing on getting everything in order first, the pre-script/outline process? In other words, know what you’re doing before sitting down to write?
DAN: I don’t know. I remember the day when there was no screenwriting software per se. You had to use adjunct programs to format your script after the fact or you’d use add-on macros. It was very difficult to do all the production things. But that’s just a word processing thing to get the right format. It does nothing.
I would divide screenwriting education into two camps. I think people can get a lot of value out of all of them. There’s one camp epitomized by Robert McKee, Truby, where these things are generally quite pricey and because of that they promise to reveal “the answer.” For commercial reasons they’re trying to take screenwriting and mystify it and tell you these are the mystical incantations that will give you the key. There’s another school represented by the books of many experienced screenwriting teachers. Richard Walter and Lew Hunter of UCLA and some of the people from USC who are doing their best to demystify screenwriting by taking sophisticated concepts and trying to put them into the most simple terms they can. They’ll talk about the sequence and the beginning of the first act, etc. in more everyday language. I think you can get something good out of all of it, so long as you don’t become a slave to any of it. But you can probably tell I have a bias towards the people trying to demystify the process.
“I think you can get something good
out of all of it, so long as you don’t
become a slave to any of it.”
I often find it incredibly useful to think about the screenplay I have in progress or outline and think about it in THE MOST BASIC TERMS. Is the climax a climax, does the end of the second act reflect the characteristics of that, is it the end of the middle and the beginning of the end? That is so valuable to me.
ABaHS: And this is ually done with outlining or when you’re writing the first draft?
DAN: Oh, no, this is outlining. And I’ll outline in Acts. I’ll very deliberately use the Acts instead of a beat sheet. I’ll use a format where you’re doing an outline that they taught you in school. Big headings, smaller headings beneath, because usually when you’re working out a plot there are scenes, sequences, Acts that you kind of know fully and some you don’t have any clue about. The ones you have no clue about and some you have full detail on might be equally important, but if you look at a beat sheet that is, “He walks down the street in front of a bank,” has equal value with “Final Action Sequence.” What helps keep everything in proportion is whether you have instead of the linear listing of beats the [Act outline] in big headings. Act I. The second level down is “The Bank Robbery” or “The First Bank Robbery” and then below that is “Casing the Joint.” Below that is “Character walks in front of the bank.” And you have this thing fully worked out in your mind. By doing it with this outline you can also choose to see only certain headings. Eventually you get there.
—-
Next time. . . Act III . . . the climax.
Recent Comments